Saturday 28 March 2009

ET is not a labrador retriever

So seven became six. One poor bugger vanished into the darkness overnight.

The poor follicle was not alone, nurse Janneke became a balding bearded male nurse, much to ET's surprise.

All of those six have shown growth. On the left, a 12mm and a 13mm, and on the right, two 14mm, a 16mm, and a 17mm.

Basically, 2 small, 2 possible, and 2 right on track.

So the IUI is canceled. Next week we make an appointment to see what the plan is from here.

If we had the IUI, we would run a 2-5% risk of multiples. 1 or 2% of those multiples would be 3 or more.

We asked about trying ourselves this month, he kept to the official line that they do not recommend that we try to conceive.

He said he would not recommend that we use the trigger shot, and to be honest I wouldn't have considered that anyway.

He told us that people have ignored this advice in the past, and come back with multiples, but "not in large numbers".

Right here, right now, we have a golden opportunity to get what we want. Our chances of turning around the 25 failures this month are much improved. We could get pregnant.

But we run a risk of a multiple pregnancy, impacting mother and babies, raising the risk of the unthinkable.

Do we go with our hearts, and be irresponsible towards lives that don't even exist, or do we sulk for a month or two, hoping that long term sensibility pays off?

This is not a choice we should have to make. This is not fair.

We're lost.


Lorna said...

My heart goes out to the two of you. What a decision to make. It must be so tempting to 'go for it' and hope that all will go well and you end up pregnant with twins. We had to have a 'rest' month recently following the miscarriage and it felt so bizarre.

Edith said...

I was hoping for better news, even though we knew that wouldn't happen.

It's just too frustrating to finally have the IUI option and than this happens...

Ms. Moon said...

I'm glad I could make you laugh, at least for a second.
The bottom line here is- this is no one's choice but yours and ET's and although no, it's not fair that you have to make it, it IS your choice.

anymommy said...

Much love, I'm sorry you're in this position.

Maggie, Dammit said...

Horrible. It's like setting a jug of water in front of someone who's been lost in the desert for a week. You're right, it's not fair.

I'm sorry.

Liz said...


Good luck making the decision. I'm glad I don't have to make it.

WhatAboutNovember said...


Mick said...

Jesus, life is tough sometimes. Hope you can, with peace of mind, come to the right decision...

(If all else fails, buy a magic 8 ball...) ;-)

Zack said...

I would do the sexy dance. But that is just me. This month holds the best chance you've had in 25 cycles. Are twins really so bad? But of course, you two need to do what is right for you.

Anonymous said...

I wish you luck with the awful decision you have to make.

Whatever your decision is, it will be the right one.

Anonymous said...


Anonymous said...

This is a tough decision. You're not alone in this situation, another IF blogger just posted about the same exact thing.

Do what you think is right.

Jill said...

It totally does suck... and yet, I'll be the oddball and say that if it were me, I'd totally go for it this month. From previous experience, a follicle should be close to 20 mm or more before it is ripe enough to be fertilized. If you only have one - maybe two that are there... those are pretty good odds to me that Spencer has a fighting chance and would give you one... or if you're lucky a two'fer.

Thankfully it's not my decision...

Mwa said...

1-2% of 2-5% is SO small! I think I would ask myself if I could deal with twins, and go on the basis of that. (I don't think I could handle twins, but then lots of people do.)

The internet is thinking of you. (And me.)

Shanny said...

Oh man this sucks so bad, sorry you and ET have to make this decision =(
If you guys are not chickens like me and decide to go for it, I really hope it works out for the best and that its no more than twins. GL.

Claire said...

I have to say I would go for it as well. 2-5% is a small chance; if you were having IVF they would put back more than one fertilised egg and even then they don't always stick. And surely the risk of having anything more than twins is smaller again? It's so fucking typical that you are in this 'famine or feast' position - good luck deciding x

Anonymous said...

I can't say anything helpful or vaguely funny. Sorry. But I am still here for you in a cyber-hug kind of way.

Anonymous said...

Oh I'm so there with you!!!! As the anonymous commenter said, we faced the same thing this month. We had four good sized (16 +) follies and one smaller (13) follie.

They gave us these odds: 15% of getting preggo in the first place, 25% of twins, 4% of triplets and less then .000something of more than that.

We DID decide to trigger for several reasons. First of all, I'm 33 going on 34...and I'm dealing with endo, pcos AND POF (premature ovarian failure), so I figure I need a little odds in my favor anyway.

We're hoping for the best and will take whatever comes. However, I'm insisting on closer monitoring next cycle so we're not in the same boat again.

This 'too much of a good thing' is miserable and NOT good!

GL with your decision!!!!


MissyBoo said...

I think I'd be more than tempted to just go for it... but thats me!

Tara R. said...

The odds for multiples is still so small. Tough choice... sorry life can't be easier for you and ET.

RRP said...

I was going to say go for it.

But then I read the Jon and Kate + 8 book. And it made me want to punch Kate in the face. And on the off chance you ended up with 6 and the became a preachy, whiney, self-righteous pain in the arse, I would feel just a wee bit responsible.

So I will refrain from encouraging and discouraging and go back to general rooting in your direction.

Foster Mama said...

I'm so sorry that the IUI was cancelled. Personally, I'd go for it. With todays medical technology, etc. ET and the babies would have the utmost care.

Best of luck with whatever you choose.

IrishNYC said...

I'd be tempted and every bit as torn as you are. I wish I had a crystal ball to tell you what would happen either way.

CableGirl said...

Well the upside is that without a trigger she'd likely not ovulate all of the follicles.

The other reality of the situation is that not all mature follicles produce mature eggs. I have a friend who went in for an IVF egg retrieval with 20 mature follicles. She got 5 eggs.

As experience has shown you, just because you ovulate and do the deed on time, it doesn't meet that you get a baby out of the mix.

The standard procedure for IVF embryo transfer is to transfer 2 or 3 embryos. While multiples are more common, transfering 2 embryos does not mean two will survive in utero.

Anyway,those are all arguments for going for it without IUI and saying fuck it to condoms... but this is coming from a bitter IUI veteran who has had multiple follies each time and still no baby.

frogpondsrock said...

Oh sweetheart, I just want to hug you both... You have waited so long already.Will waiting for another month really hurt? It will be frustrating but as hard as it is for me to say this because I am a doer. I like to be doing and I HATE HATE HATE waiting. I reckon you should have a shag free month and just go and get rat-faced drunk.. (((hugs)))

Anonymous said...

I was going to say the same as cablegirl. Not necessarily all of the follicles will mature and produce eggs. And she won't ovulate all of them without the trigger.

I say go for it. I know that I would in that position because I want a baby so much.

Good luck, whatever you decide.

Veronica said...

No advice. ((hugs))

Robin said...

I feel like I don't know enough about the science behind it to say what I would do in your situation. But, if there's a chance that the end result will be a healthy baby or two, or even three, and that's your ultimate goal (and ET wouldn't be in any danger), then go for it. What do you have to lose?

Anonymous said...

Wow, that's a rough decision. More to the point, how is Spencer gonna feel wearing a raincoat in the shower when he's had free range for so bloody long?

Good luck mate, I'll be thinking of you both.

Myst_72 said...

For some reason every time I read one of your posts I have thought 'it'll be o.k. - you'll end up with twins - twice the blessing'....

What a decision.

Go with your gut!


Hilary (Maya Papaya) said...

I feel awfully cheeky for saying this but yeah, if it were me I'd probably go for it. But then again, I'm an optimist about these sort of things. This is the best chance you've had yet so I say carpe diem. Maybe that's bad advice, I don't know. But honestly that's what I'd do with the information you've been given. The chance of extreme multiples is pretty small. But it is a risk nonetheless. Tough one. But my gut is saying go for it.

Sorry I've not been commenting as much lately- been so busy- but I definitely have been reading, my friend.

Good luck with your decision. I'll be thinking of you.

Jayne said...

Yep, go with your gut instinct, listen to that little voice inside you, talk to ET lots.
In the end it's up to you both (((hugs)))

Widdle Shamrock said...

As if it couldn't get any tougher.

My gut says 'just go for it'.

However, I also know the flip side of losing a multiple. I also know people who have had triplets or quads, lost one or more, overly early delivery, and the long road of developmental delays.

Yet for every 'sad' story, I also know of happy endings, with no complications and no challenges for the children.

It just seems to be 'luck of the draw' what is going to happen which makes a decision like this so hard.

All the best with your decision.

Hockeyman said...

that sucks, I say fuck it, fire away captain.

Sarah said...

I'm sorry hun. I really am.

Tracey said...

Speechless. Still reading, still hoping and praying, but just can't ever think of anything meaningful to say. xo

I Am Emily... said...

I am sitting here saying out loud 'go for it' but I don't know the full extent of the risks involved so I will sit back and see what you decide. It is a very tempting choice...good luck with it, whatever you decide.

battynurse said...

No. Truly isn't fair. Sucks donkey balls pretty much. I'm sorry.

Mistress B said...

That just totally sucks.

I don't envy you that choice.

BABY STEPS said...

Take the choice out of your hands-flip a coin!

tiff said...

It is your decision ultimately, not a nurse or a doctor. You need to weigh up all the pros and cons but...

Once, I was hyperstimulated. 10 follies on one side and another 7 on the other! It was painful and very very ugly moodwise. I was still triggered and we did the deed too. We knew the risks of multiples we knew the stats but we did it anyway. It was worth it.
It didn't result in a pregnancy but a chance was a chance.

Good luck.

Making Babies said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Making Babies said...

I'm agreeing with the above comments. To hell with it. The most mature follicle or maybe follicles(2) will be released. At least then you would have 2 eggs to deal with. 2 chances of fertilization. 2 chances of implantation. I honestly can't see all 6 popping. Very unlikely! It's so odd how they work there. But who are we to argue, I'm sure they know what they are doing.... But still how many women go with IUI and IVF and have 3,4 or more eggs to deal with. Aai, I'm sorry you have to deal with this. The one month you have a reasonably good chance...... Wishing you luck with what ever you decide to do..... x

Sorry I had to delete my previous post, way too many spelling mistakes... I was so pissed off for you guys... wasn't concentrating!!!!

Momo Fali said...

I have no advice, but I just wanted to let you guys know I'm thinking of you and hope this goes well...whatever you decide.

AnnD said...

I'm so sorry. I agree. It's not fair that you even have to make this choice. And I really don't think there is a right answer...

I'm having a really difficult time writing this reply because my first instinct is to say: "Fuck the doctor, he/she is just trying to protect their ass from getting sued! Do the deed and if you guys end up with 2 or 3 then so be it!" But, I also appreciate the guilt you fear you'll experience if something horrible were to happen....whatever happens and whatever you decide, you have my support (not that it means anything at this point), but I wouldn't judge you either way.

Anonymous said...

Oh bloody hell - it's never simple is it? I'm so sorry. I'm not going to offer you advice, I have no idea what I'd do in your situation. Not sure I'd have had the strength to get to this point. Whatever you choose, I hope it's ok.

Donnamarie x said...

I would go for it, if not you may be left wondering what if ??
But then thats just me, I would love healthy twins through the ivf/icsi that I need, I would have my family in one go and not have to go through any more of this IF shit.
Good Luck in making your decision. x x x x x x x

nh said...

ugh - a difficult decision to take! I think
- go with your gut and make sure you are both happy with whatever decision you reach.

Sorry I can't be more help than that!

Mr Lady said...

Twins are really nice to have your first time around...just sayin'.

Serenity said...

2-5% of multiples. With an IUI. That seems like a really low risk to not even go for it. Because your chances naturally are lower without the IUI.

But only you and ET know if you're prepared to handle multiples, you know? If you play out all the scenarios, what do your guts say?

At the end, that's all that matters.

It's not fair. Not at all.

Hugs and the hopes that you can make a choice that you're both at peace with.


Sinead said...

I would take my chances. If you can have octuplets safely, then surely twins aren't too bad?
Only downside would be having twins, living away from family and friends who could be of help. I found it difficult with one child with no family support.

Tough call...

Anonymous said...

The percentage rate seems so low, but I know still a risk that makes
you apprehensive. It is indeed a hard decision, but I would go with your heart and will not stir you wrong. When I had my fifth loss I had made the decision never to try again. I did not want to put me, my family and my body through anymore pain. But I did it anyway, I was so mad at myself and when I found out I was pregnant I was terrified and thought "what have I done" here I go again. But 9 mths later....Feb 27th 2009 my miracle appeared before me. I am so glad I took the plunge even though it seemed reckless at the time. This little guy was meant to be here.
Best of of everything to both of you.

Jenni said...

do it.

C said...

Arghh this is so unfair!!!

(hugs)...only you know what is best for you...

Proseaholics said...

On a completely unrelated note, I think you need to buy a puppy.

You'd be surprised how quickly you can make a well informed / unbiased / urgent decision after trying one.

Of course, not all of them taste the same...

River said...

I remember the comment I left last time and have to say that now, after giving it some thought, and knowing that you still have so many ripening follicles, you and ET probably need to let this one go. It's hard to see such a possibility "go down the rain", but the risk of multiples to mother and babies just isn't worth it. If more follicles had died I would have still said go for it, but not now. Better luck next time.

G said...

What an impossible choice!! You're right, it's totally unfair. I would feel lost too. Good luck with whatever you decide ((hugs))

Heather said...

I'd go for it if I were you. But it isn't my decision. Good luck.

Karen MEG said...

Oh Xbox, ET, what a horrible position to be in. Gahhhh!!! I hate those rules, numbers, stats. And advice, opinions, there are so many things to think about your heads must just be spinning.

Not that you're asking, but if it were me I would have likely gone for it...that being said, my husband was terrified of multiples and was even hesitant for me to start on Clomid!! But then I've got the experience of unsuccessful IUI's to cloud my judgement, after 5 failures, this would have seemed like I hit the lottery. The chances of multiples are so, so slim, but unfortunately, the chance is still there.

This is such an intensely personal decision, and heartbreaking as you've been waiting so long for this moment.

Good luck to the two of you in finding the best answer. Hugs, and thinking about you...

Louise said...

This is the saddest thing I have read in a long time. I am crying for you as I read the post.

What a hard decision to have to make. I have been following your blog for a long time now.

Best of luck and I hope you make the right decision - whatever that might be.

B said...


...just damn

Kori said...

You make the best decision you can with the information you have available at that moment-that is the best any of us have. Whatever you DO decide, DO NOT look back and second guess it. Thinking of you.

Anonymous said...

Like every other Irish person here (it seems) I think I would go for it too, it would be too tempting not to. Also like everyone else, I'm wishing you the best.

Boliath xx

meabh said...

personally I wouldn't go for it as its not just twins were talking here, its lots of babies.Its out of your control how many. That would cause way too much anxiety.You can do with out that.You guys want a healthy baby so I would be listening to the best advice.You dont want the situation of selective reduction. That would be just too hard.

I was TTC #1 for 3 years. Offered IUI with stimming but I asked for it naturally for the first cycle. I produced 1 egg, it fertilised & I have a wee boy to prove it. You only need one egg. If ET is ovulating could you ask for it au naturale next time then there will be no cancelling & no risk?
My advice, take fertility holiday this month, do all the stuff you have been putting off, get locked then come back next month & go after 1 egg.
Take it easy

Martin said...

@Lorna - We had one following the laparoscopy and it was bloody hard, but for some reason this is different. Its not the NOT trying, its the not try when our chances are so much improved.
Window of opportunity.

@Edith - Yes, frustrating is the word.

@Ms. Moon - Best laugh I had in a while I'll tell you.

@anymommy - Thank you.

@Maggie, Dammit - Thanks.

@womb for improvement - Chicken ;-)

@WhatAboutNovember - Yes, quite!

@Mick - It's as good a way as any to decide I'm starting to think.

@Zack - Twins carry risks. 3, 4, 5, or 6 carry bigger ones. That's the worry.

@RiotGrrlCynic - Thank you.

@Maxi Cane - Indeed.

@Anonymous - I read that, 'funny' how the situations are similar.

@Jill - Yes, we know the ODDS are in our favour regarding multiples, but a chance is a chance.

@Mwa - Thanks :-)

@Shanny - One would be enough!

@Claire - Incidentally, our hospital have very strict rules on transferring 2 embryos even in IUI.

@Tismee2 - Thanks.

@infertilityrocks - Good luck to you!

@M+B - The temptation is in no doubt!

@Tara R. - Yes & yes.

@RRP - I can't look at that show.

@Foster Mama - Hmmm. Not sure that's a good enough reason to be honest. Thanks.

@IrishNYC - Thank you.

@CableGirl - It is very interesting how all your individual experiences are forming your advice. Although, that's all we have to go on.

@frogpondsrock - Will it? Yes.

@S - Thank you.

@Veronica - Thanks.

@Robin - A lot could be lost, a very tiny chance, but it could.

@abritdifferent - Spencer can go finger himself. Useless git.

@Myst_72 - As good a reason as any!

@Hilary (Maya Papaya) - Thank you.

@Jayne - In the end, it is indeed. Thanks.

@Widdle Shamrock - Wow. Yikes.

@Hockeyman - suck it does.

@Sarah - Thanks.

@Tracey - No worries ;-)

@Tanya - It very much is.

@battynurse - Thanks.

@Mistress B - Me neither.

@Paint it Black - Again, as good as any.

@tiff - Thanks Tiff.

@Making Babies - Yep, I know all the ifs and buts. Over and back ;-)

@Momo Fali - Thank you.

@AnnD - Thanks Ann.

@bsouth - No, simple it aint.

@Bubba - There wil be 'what ifs' either way, thats for sure.

@nh - No worries.

@Mr Lady - Hmmmmmmm

@serenity - Low risk yes, but a risk.

@Sinead - The family thing can be a blessing in disguise ;-) Thanks.

@Deno - YES YES YES!!!!
Congratulations, a little early was he?

I am absolutely delighted for you. Enjoy!

@Jenni - Nike.

@Chhandita - If only we really did!

@Monty's Python - nah, too much responsibility

@River - Thanks.

@G - Thank you.

@Heather - funny, thanks.

@Karen MEG - Thank you :-)

@Louise - God don't be crying. Thanks.

@B - Don't get these issues with the vet do you...

@Kori - Yes. True.

@Boliath - Far from every Irish person has said go for it actually, in fact its seems 50-50 from them. But thanks, and welcome!

@meabh - I know what you are saying, the risk is removed totally if we don't. But... so is this chance. Thanks. (Welcome)

Deb said...

I'm a go for it kind of girl myself, but then, I was insane enough to think I wanted twins after all that trying to get pregnant for so long.

Good luck, no matter what you decide.

Ashling said...

Difficult position to be in, But I'd go for it if we were in the same position.
Usualy as another poster said only one or 2 follicles mature and close in size would be released, as to get more of the follicles it would need the trigger which your not doing,so the risk would be lessened. But its up to you and your wife to decide whether or not to take the risk.
One thing I don't understand is why did they put ET on 100mg of clomid instead of 50mg. As far as I know most start out on 50mg and get moved up if the reaction isnt good enough.
Good luck with whatever you decide to do.

B said...

I think you can actually... I'll phone home and check

...actually that might sound odd

Anonymous said...

How terribly disappointing. And what a dreadful position to be in.

I remember that I cried when our IF doctor informed me that they only put one embryo back with IVF. Now I'm thinking that thank goodness that they have that rule, because, seriously? Multiples? Holy Hannah.

Big decision. I'll be thinking of you.

Martin said...

@Deb - Thanks.

@Ashling - 100 is a medium dose, and I imagine the best one to start on, and gauge how much up or down you need to go.

@B - That would be one interesting phone conversation

@expatswede - Thanks.

Cheryl said...

I just stumbled on your blog, what a huge decision for you, not one to take lightly.
I just finished IVF...I am right there with your feelings, what a ride.
Good luck!! I will keep my fingers crossed for you!

Sarah said...

Ok, you're talking about inseminating a frog....and I'M the freak?

nola said...

You better start picking names out. You are SO CLOSE. The process now is fine tuning. If there were NO follicles, that'd be bad news. Seven that are mature? That's GREAT! That means less Clomid next cycle, to get less follicles. How exciting!!! Things are happening!! Things that are covered by insurance!!!! SWEET!!!

Bluestreak said...

ugh, damn hard. I don't know if I could hold back, but that's because in general I'm extremely impatient.

Fingers crossed for you.

Martin said...

@Cheryl - Hi Cheryl, welcome.
When you say you've just finished, how far are you?

@Sarah - Yes, you are.

@nola - There will be no name picking. trust me.

@Bluestreak - Thanks.